Question:
I'm having trouble finding info on this technique. Sometimes I think I'm close to understanding it, but I don't feel confident about it. I'm not sure what it's called--double stops, partial barre, ? I would really like to use the U2 Edge technique to add more flavor for worship songs. One thing I'm talking about is when you do a partial barre with your index finger at, say the 7th fret on the first 3 GBE strings. You can put your middle finger on the 8th fret B string to make a G. Then I've seen people put their pinky on the 10th fret B and E strings, and sometimes use their ring finger on the 9th fret G string. Ok, so far, so good, but how do you use that in a song? Like a typical 1-4-5 progression? That's where I'm lost. I don't know if I'm playing chords or part of a scale (it's kind of both).
So let's take, for example, a well known worship song--Blessed Be Your Name. The chorus goes G-D-Em-C. How do you do the drone technique over that?
Or that song "Lifesong"--there's a neat drone progression in the chorus--you know, it goes "Let my life song sing to you"--(guitar part): Nee-ner--ne-ne-ner, Nee-ner-ne-ne-ner.
I could probably figure out by sound what notes he's playing there in that second example, but I would just be aping it--it goes back to my ignorance on how to apply the drone technique to any given worship song (where it would fit) and how to know what I'm doing.
Same for any kind of double-stop. I look at the chord sheet and key of the song, but how do I figure out what double notes to play if I want to do a drone?
Thanks for any help you can give me!
Note to moderator: should this go here or in the guitar forum?
Answer:
say the 7th fret on the first 3 GBE strings. You can put your middle finger on the 8th fret B string to make a G. Then I've seen people put their pinky on the 10th fret B and E strings, and sometimes use their ring finger on the 9th fret G string.
Well you are building a chord with what you described there.
On the first (e)string 7th fret is a B
on the 2nd (b) string 8th fret is a G
on the 3rd (g) string 7th fret is a D
these three notes make up the G major chord.
When you apply your pinky to the 10th frets that adds in a D and an A, making D A D, and A is the is the 5th note of the D major scale which gives you a D5 chord. So essentially when you are doing that you are playing the first chord in G, G major, then the 5th chord D major.
So for the G-D-Em-C. you asked about you alkready have the G and the D, all you need is the E minor and the C. Well E minor 5 string bar is right there starting with the E on the A string, or you could go up and barre the twelth fret and put yourthird finger on the G string at the 14th fret (E). For the C major play full 6 string c major or do the exact same G major shape you started with at the 12 and 13th fret. I am not sure what kind of sound you are aiming for and I have only heard the song you asked about once or twice so you'll just ahve to experiment. Of course there are tons of ways to play each chord so you'll just have to figure which sounds best with what you are playing.
Answer:
I take a "drone" to mean a single pitch that is repeated over different chords. To find a drone note, you need to figure out a pitch that can be used as common tone over a given chord progression. The first or the fifth of the I chord is usually a good candidate for the drone note.
Let's use "Blessed Be Your Name" as an example in the key of C. The chord progression goes like this: C - G - Am - F. For a drone note we can use C. The C note is found in the C chord (the 1st), the Am chord (the 3rd), and the F chord (the 5th). In the G chord, the C note would be a suspended 4th.
So in order to do the U2 drone thing on "Blessed Be Your Name" you can use the following chords, using the C on the 8th fret of the 1st string as the drone:
x-x-x-5-5-8 (C)
x-x-x-7-8-8 (G)
x-x-x-5-5-8 (Am)
x-x-x-5-6-8 (F)
In fact, I hear something like the above progression on the soft part of the song just before the band come back full blast.
Answer:
Thanks, guys.
One thing that I didn't realize is that I don't have to make a full chord--everyman, from what you say, it sounds like I can use two notes from a chord to cover it. You say the first and fifth of the I chord will work--would the third work, too? (or if it was minor, a flatted third?)
I noticed that x-x-x-5-5-8 (the notes C-E-C) can be played both over the C (CEG) and Am (ACE). So I gather that works because the C and E are common to both. So then, alternatively, I could also barre x-x-x-5-5-5 (CEA) for the Am, right? Or just any two of those 5s? And then I could go x-x-x-5-8-8 (CGC) for the C, right? Or just x-x-x-5-8-x or x-x-x-x-8-8?
And then to change key from F to G, I just shift up two frets, right? So this whole thing is movable? I think I'm getting it.
I also notice that all these notes fit the part of the F major scale like this:
5th A-D-G-C-E-A
6th A#------F-A#
7th ----E-A-D----
8th C-F-A#--G-C
So, extending that scale...
9th --------E----
10th D-G-C-F-A-D
11th ---------A#-
12th E-A-D-G---E
13th F-A#----C-F
So if a complete C is at x-x-x-9-8-8, can I just play x-x-x-x-8-8 for an effective drone? And then would x-x-x-9-8-x work equally well?
And Am at x-x-x-9-10-8? F at x-x-x-10-10-8? G at x-x-x-12-12-10? And could I play any two of those strings for a decent drone?
Sorry, this is turning into a long post--I just want to make sure I'm getting it right. So in the mind of the guitarist, do you memorize which combination goes over which chord, or is there another way of thinking it through? I would like to get to the point where it becomes pretty much automatic and I don't even have to hardly think about it, but could just do it on the fly.
Answer:
Regarding the lack of a 3rd in drone chords, you probably know that technically, it takes 3 notes to make a chord and 2 notes are an interval. However, for our modern tastes, the 1st and the 5th are all you really need to make a "chord." For example, the 3-5-5-x-x-x power chord doesn't have a 3rd. I guess you can say that for the purposes of contemporary pop music, a prominently voiced 3rd makes a chord too bright and less edgy.
Keep experimenting with using different chords over a common pitch until you come upon combinations that sound good to you and fit the music.
There are certain chord combinations that are used a lot in CCM and you can find patterns that can be adapted for a number of songs.
Another type of drone is the open string drone. "I Will Follow" is an example of a U2 song that uses this technique. A CCM example would be the introductory riff of Chris Tomlin's "Your Grace Is Enough."
Answer:
Originally Posted by everyman Keep experimenting with using different chords over a common pitch until you come upon combinations that sound good to you and fit the music.
I think you're right that experimenting around will be key. I'd like it to come automatically, but that takes time, I guess.
There are certain chord combinations that are used a lot in CCM and you can find patterns that can be adapted for a number of songs.
Would you mind showing some of these? Or linking? Thanks!
Another type of drone is the open string drone. "I Will Follow" is an example of a U2 song that uses this technique. A CCM example would be the introductory riff of Chris Tomlin's "Your Grace Is Enough."
But only if the open string is the first or fifth, right?
Answer:
I think you've gotten the idea. Now just go ahead and experiment with the fretboard. And may the Drone be with you.
Answer:
Very good advice--I was just doing that tonight. I think that the more I practice doing it along with recordings, the more I'll get used to it. Thanks for your help.
BTW, for anyone reading this thread who is in the same situation as I am, I found http://www.cyberfret.com/scales/guitar-codex/index.php to be very helpful in finding the notes.
Answer:
And don't forget the most important part.....
What tone to use on your amp.
Chris Tomlin's guitar player does this style a LOT, and our church does his worship songs a LOT, so I try to recreate the same tone......which is basically a clean sound, with chorus, and a heavy delay.
If your bass player and drummer are aggressive players, you can get away with having a slight gain on the clean sound. Just make sure that if you play two strings at the same time, see that the two notes don't "fuzz" together (if that makes sense)
I usually never play more than 3 strings at a time, and it's usually the E, B, and G strings. The drone note, is usually on the E string, but sometimes I'll alternate between the E and the G string, depending if I want to do some pinky work on the E string.
Knowing the tone settings, effects used, what strings are used, take a listen to some later Tomlin CD's and listen to how creative that guitar player gets with the chords. Cool stuff, and fun stuff to play.
Chris
Answer:
I would agree with the above post. As an avid U2 fan, and someone who uses Edge-ish delay a LOT in leading worship, I think that amp tone and getting an instinctive feel for your effects, most importantly the delay, is more important than what specific notes you play. I can take even regular open chords (G2-C2-D/Dsus-Em7) and make them sound Edge-ish by arpeggiating the notes, esp. the higher strings, and most importantly, by getting the right feel with the delay.
So, FWIW, here are my observations on getting U2 sound for worship:
Amp tone: Edge uses almost exclusively a Vox AC30 (and, coincidentally, so does Daniel Carson, Chris Tomlin's guitarist). I have a Crate Palomino V16, which does great crunch but the clean sounded just too "clean" when trying to get U2 chime. So I spent a little money and got a Menatone Top Boost in a Can, which is technically a distortion pedal but it aims to replicate the top boost channel on a Vox AC30. A Vox Over the Top Boost also does the same thing. Now I can get that little bit of grit and chime to color my cleans without getting too fuzzy.
Delay: The MOST important thing to consider. You have to get your delay repeats precisely between the notes you are playing to get the sound you're looking for. By far, the easiest way for me was a delay with a tap tempo--in my case, a Boss DD-5 with the external tap tempo switch. Set the delay setting to dotted eighth notes, and tap with the four beats in 4/4 time, and your delay repeats will play back perfectly between the notes you play. You want the repeats to be nearly as loud as the clean signal, and only one or two repeats per notes.
The pick: Huh? Yeah, one of the real secrets to Edge tone is using a Herdim pick, a pick with the part you hold textured. Instead of striking the strings with the point of the pick, turn it sideways and strike the strings with one of the corners that is usually between your thumb and forefinger. Any pick that has a textured part that you hold will work, but I've found that Herdims are best because the textured part goes all the way to the edge; some stop short of the edge. You'll probably have to order Herdims over the web. This picking technique gives your notes a little hint of a scraping sound. You can really hear this when the Edge palm mutes, like the verses of "Where the Streets Have No Name".
Modulation: The final essential element of Edge tone is modulation, which is the little bit of "shimmer" that many of his tones have. Many delays (Electro-Harmonix Memory Man, Boss DD-20) have a "modulated delay" setting, which I've heard is good. My DD-5, doesn't, so I use a combination of chorus (Small Clone) and the "Octo" setting on my Line 6 Verbzilla. U2 fans are pretty big on the Verbzilla for the Octo setting. Edge doesn't use modulation on all songs, but especially the slower ones, and chorus and "Octo" will get you pretty close.
Sorry for rambling on so long. But this has been a long-time pursuit of mine, getting the Edge tone nailed. Just for comparison, you can check out the forums at http://www.u2sound-forum.com/ --these people are true fanatics.
Hope my ramblings helped.
Answer:
Originally Posted by plawren53202 .
Hope my ramblings helped. They sure did! I appreciate anything you guys have to say on this matter!