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On this forum, we criticize, tear, down and marginalize people over minute statements in posts, instead of focusing on their strengths. It a sad thing, and it happens in almost every thread - just look at any post involving Hillsongs, excitement or overall emotion in worship.
In the quest for good doctrine, we demean and discourage - the opposite of the intended purpose of this forum. We may even have the bible on our side in our criticism. But if we are not filtering what we say through grace and love, then everyone loses.
The theology forum went through this same thing. People are never going to be perfect, or perfectly articulate in the explanation of their practices. That is no reason to fire a doctrinal missile. Don't kid yourself - it's not going to build anyone up, or teach anyone, and it happens every day here.
Please, think before you post. Everyone has flaws, but if the focus is on those flaws, we magnify and exacerbate the negative, instead of encouraging growth and strength. Positivity and love work, and not in a floofy, flippant way. I just don't think that when I see criticism, there is any love or encouragement at in it, at least most of the time. Perhaps this is the cost of an anynonymous web board where we are not required to be truly accountable for our words to anyone. But we can still try, and still apply the principles of love.
I just think we all - myself including - need to engage the heart before the keyboard.
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Originally Posted by niangelo On this forum, we criticize, tear, down and marginalize people over minute statements in posts, instead of focusing on their strengths. It a sad thing, and it happens in almost every thread - just look at any post involving Hillsongs, excitement or overall emotion in worship.
In the quest for good doctrine, we demean and discourage - the opposite of the intended purpose of this forum. We may even have the bible on our side in our criticism. But if we are not filtering what we say through grace and love, then everyone loses.
The theology forum went through this same thing. People are never going to be perfect, or perfectly articulate in the explanation of their practices. That is no reason to fire a doctrinal missile. Don't kid yourself - it's not going to build anyone up, or teach anyone, and it happens every day here.
Please, think before you post. Everyone has flaws, but if the focus is on those flaws, we magnify and exacerbate the negative, instead of encouraging growth and strength. Positivity and love work, and not in a floofy, flippant way. I just don't think that when I see criticism, there is any love or encouragement at in it, at least most of the time. Perhaps this is the cost of an anynonymous web board where we are not required to be truly accountable for our words to anyone. But we can still try, and still apply the principles of love.
I just think we all - myself including - need to engage the heart before the keyboard.
Very good post. I normally try to read my own stuff back as if I were the one receiving it before I click on "Submit Reply" and yet probably post stuff that can be received as more harsh than it's intended. THAT'S one of the caveats of web/net conversation as compared to personal interaction and conversation; lack of facial and tonal expressiveness that normally compliments person-to-person communication means that the words have to stand all on their own, for better or for worse.
No number of emoticons can make up for the absence of personal interaction
See?!
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Originally Posted by niangelo On this forum, we criticize, tear, down and marginalize people over minute statements in posts, instead of focusing on their strengths. It a sad thing, and it happens in almost every thread - just look at any post involving Hillsongs, excitement or overall emotion in worship.
I've just looked over the top 10 current threads in here, and I found evidence of this maybe happening in one thread (Hillsongs music was callled "happy, clappy,..." in such a way as to suggest that it is inferior as worship music). Had trouble finding it in other threads, though - any specifics?
Originally Posted by niangelo In the quest for good doctrine, we demean and discourage - the opposite of the intended purpose of this forum. We may even have the bible on our side in our criticism. But if we are not filtering what we say through grace and love, then everyone loses.
I'm probably in the minority, but if I come on the forum and I'm hyping up a song that someone else has a theological problem with, I want to know what the theological problem is so that I can think about it. I personally appreciate the thoughtfulness of those who think about the songs we sing from a doctrinal perspective. I certainly wouldn't want to shut them off in sharing their views, although it's possible that some of these folks could be a tad more diplomatic at times. Anyway, I like it when people question me as to "why are you having your congregation sing that song when it says _____..." But maybe I'm wierd.
Originally Posted by niangelo The theology forum went through this same thing. People are never going to be perfect, or perfectly articulate in the explanation of their practices. That is no reason to fire a doctrinal missile. Don't kid yourself - it's not going to build anyone up, or teach anyone, and it happens every day here.
As someone who has hung around that forum reading a lot, but not posting much (maybe like yourself), I really felt that Theology was far more conflict-flame-baiting-bash-your-position-and-your-person-into-the-ground oriented than this forum has ever been. Ever. We get a wild one every now and again, but Theology gets them every day.
Originally Posted by niangelo Please, think before you post. Everyone has flaws, but if the focus is on those flaws, we magnify and exacerbate the negative, instead of encouraging growth and strength. Positivity and love work, and not in a floofy, flippant way. I just don't think that when I see criticism, there is any love or encouragement at in it, at least most of the time. Perhaps this is the cost of an anynonymous web board where we are not required to be truly accountable for our words to anyone. But we can still try, and still apply the principles of love.
I don't see the kind of "floofy, flippant" criticism that you speak of rearing its head in this forum on a regular basis. Most of the critiques I read here are (I think) rather well thought-out. I know that many of the times I've responded to a situation critically, the post has been a product of considerable thought - I usually try to imagine if I was handling the problem with my people.
In sum: I think there's a certain value to "keeping the peace," but there's certainly something lost when that becomes the focus. In worship leading, you've got to have thick skin, because sometimes you're going to to dumb stuff that you need to take some heat for, while other times you'll be headed the right direction and nobody else will think you are. Also, when doctrine is an issue, I think that raises the stakes somewhat - I'd be uncomfortable leading people in singing doctrinally "floofy" songs, and if someone on here gets the picture that I'm doing that through one of my posts, I want to hear about it.
Nate
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I believe it was me who made the "happy clappy" reference to Hillsongs' music and I make no apologies for doing so in reference to the topic of the thread in which it was mentioned.
I'm sure there's no surprise regarding my opinion of the majority of Hillsongs' music; I don't care for it but if someone else is blessed by listening to or performing it, have at it.
And 2000 points to you, Nate, for using the word "floofy".
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Originally Posted by gtrdave I believe it was me who made the "happy clappy" reference to Hillsongs' music and I make no apologies for doing so in reference to the topic of the thread in which it was mentioned.
I'm sure there's no surprise regarding my opinion of the majority of Hillsongs' music; I don't care for it but if someone else is blessed by listening to or performing it, have at it.
And 2000 points to you, Nate, for using the word "floofy".
I agree about Hillsongs - I refrain from using most of their music for that reason.
Nate's points are all valid. They are all valid, and truthful.
But when the first thing we come out with is criticism in a response, on a consistent basis, a pattern seems to develop - one that we need to be very careful about.
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Without attempting to come up with specifics...in the years I have been a regular member this is something I have noticed too. I have often been concerned at the lack of grace that often shows up in response to posts. I also know that it is difficult to truly express one's motives on a message board to complete strangers. That said, I do wish some more care was often taken with responses around here. I have had to learn the hard way that often the first thought that comes to mind isn't always the best one.
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Originally Posted by Dave H I have had to learn the hard way that often the first thought that comes to mind isn't always the best one.
You and me both.
You know that phrase, "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."? Not. True. Words are more powerful than we are aware of, and when people mistake our posts for something else, or if we meant it, it could end in a bad way. I'd know from experience on this board. Obviously not highlighting any members, but it sometimes seems like I'm looked down on, and my opinion isn't valid, for lack of experience and such, musically and theologically. It's quite degrading, I'd know. Eventually it turns into the struggle to be "good enough" for the members you look up to. Not a good road to go down. We all need to make an effort to "loven" up our posts, as it were... We're all part of one body. Without one part, we can't function as well as normal. We all want to be important and try to show people that our beliefs are right, but the trouble is, almost everyone believes that. Unity doesn't always mean agreement.
So yeah, I'm glad this community can see when there's something going on, and I'm willing to do my part to try to be more Christ-like on the boards
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Good comments all. I know I need to be careful too.
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Moderators, of course, have dispensation, and can be as petty as they want.

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Originally Posted by Tony Moderators, of course, have dispensation, and can be as petty as they want.
Amen.

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i have a stuffed toy doggie named Floofy!!!
bobby
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Originally Posted by nate95366 I'm probably in the minority, but if I come on the forum and I'm hyping up a song that someone else has a theological problem with, I want to know what the theological problem is so that I can think about it. I personally appreciate the thoughtfulness of those who think about the songs we sing from a doctrinal perspective. I certainly wouldn't want to shut them off in sharing their views, although it's possible that some of these folks could be a tad more diplomatic at times. Anyway, I like it when people question me as to "why are you having your congregation sing that song when it says _____..." But maybe I'm wierd. I think the concern isn't so much that people are critical, but moreso the manner that they are critical. I also can't find any good examples off hand. The "use of video in services" thread almost breaks the line into incendiary. Usually these sorts of things are more opinion-slinging than anything else.
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Guys I post on several Christian guitar forums. This one in particular seems to be different and comes off at times rather harsh and confusing. From having Primordial Demons and resident atheist to condecending posts that seem to be devoid of any Christian love and tact. I see folks here I would like to get to know better but shy away from posting on this forum most of the time as it seems a rather dangerious place to hang out. I got my fill of flame wars over religious topics on the old Carvin BBS. I am not condeming any one person here but this BBS at times seems volitile, devoid of Christian Love and gives me the willies some times. I don't need the grief so I just stay away.
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Originally Posted by shreadhead Guys I post on several Christian guitar forums. This one in particular seems to be different and comes off at times rather harsh and confusing. From having Primordial Demons and resident atheist to condecending posts that seem to be devoid of any Christian love and tact. I see folks here I would like to get to know better but shy away from posting on this forum most of the time as it seems a rather dangerious place to hang out. I got my fill of flame wars over religious topics on the old Carvin BBS. I am not condeming any one person here but this BBS at times seems volitile, devoid of Christian Love and gives me the willies some times. I don't need the grief so I just stay away. I have to admit that this is the primary reason why I give my theological questions by PM or email to a CGR user I trust instead of posting questions on the board, since they usually answer my questions a lot more lovingly. But I have to say, CGR is a lot more personable and friendly than Christian Forums. I swear, half of their users are on a personal vendetta against anyone who doesn't agree with their theology.
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Originally Posted by jengoesup But I have to say, CGR is a lot more personable and friendly than Christian Forums. I swear, half of their users are on a personal vendetta against anyone who doesn't agree with their theology. Wow maybe I'm just blessed to have be on the boards I have because to me it seems just the opposite. A good # of the guys I personally knew from the old Carvin BBS and I all went to three BBS boards as a group after the rule about religious topics and the flame wars started. We know each other personally and have mutual respect for one another. I just though that type enviorment was the norm on a Christian BBS guess not .