Question:
Hey guys,
I was wondering if anyone else 'updates' hymns before playing them? by this i mean things like changing "Thee" to "You" etc.
I often do this as I find it makes them easier to sing and engage in if they are in language you actually use!
obviously I won't if it seriously affects the flow/rhyme etc. but generally it is a case of a straight swap more or less.
does anyone else do this or is it just me being sacreligious?!
(mmm...sacrelicious...)
God bless, Rich
Answer:
The devo the worship team and i were doing just this past Saturday mentionned about rewording hymns.
In a way, it is...good, because of relevance.
It's somewhat more relevant for the congregation to sing "You" instead of "Thee" and it would also help them understand what they're singing.
ie. "Yours" instead of "Thine"
But sometimes, its the thee's and thine's that give hymns its spice. : D
Answer:
Originally Posted by Addone But sometimes, its the thee's and thine's that give hymns its spice. absolutely, there are some songs I would never do it to (Thine be the glory, How great Thou art etc.)
Answer:
One major problem is the word "Thou" a lot of the time there is nothing good to change it to (Think "Come Thou Fount"). Then you end up with a old/new mess. I prefer to just leave the hymns as they are.
Answer:
I generally leave them as-is, too, but not out of sacrelige reasons, more out of singing "flow" reasons. If the song has such a tangle of hithers and thithers that it seems to make no sense on the first pass, then I might consider changing those words.
Nate
Answer:
Originally Posted by nate95366 I generally leave them as-is, too, but not out of sacrelige reasons, more out of singing "flow" reasons. If the song has such a tangle of hithers and thithers that it seems to make no sense on the first pass, then I might consider changing those words.
Nate
Same here- plus when I try to change words, the congregation always seems really confused
BTW, Nate- I noticed you are from Omaha. Which church do you lead worship at?
Answer:
Originally Posted by nate95366 I generally leave them as-is, too, but not out of sacrelige reasons, more out of singing "flow" reasons. If the song has such a tangle of hithers and thithers that it seems to make no sense on the first pass, then I might consider changing those words.
Nate There are only a few old hymns that we do and we keep em as is, because those are the words people know.
"Thine be the glory" works BECAUSE it's written in pilgrimspeak.
"Be thou my vision" also
If you want a modern rewrite, then redo the tune as well
Just my opinion, fel free to disagree!!
Answer:
Originally Posted by BelovedOne BTW, Nate- I noticed you are from Omaha. Which church do you lead worship at?
Papio Creek Church, which currently meets at "The Rock" in downtown Papillion. Sunday services start at 10 AM.
Nate
Answer:
In general, I prefer to keep original texts, although there have been some pretty good adaptations.
I despise the ones that mix old and modern English. "I am Thine, O, Lord; I have heard Your voice..." just kills me.
Answer:
I leave them as-is and explain obscure words or phrases - better to make people smarter than our hymns dumber.
"Here I raise mine Ebenezer, hither by Thy help I'm come" is perhaps the single greatest line in any worship song ever.
"Hear him, ye deaf; His praise, ye dumb, your loosened tongues employ" is a very close second.
Answer:
Originally Posted by pgr181 "Here I raise mine Ebenezer, hither by Thy help I'm come" is perhaps the single greatest line in any worship song ever.

Answer:
Originally Posted by pgr181 I leave them as-is and explain obscure words or phrases - better to make people smarter than our hymns dumber.
"Here I raise mine Ebenezer, hither by Thy help I'm come" is perhaps the single greatest line in any worship song ever.
"Hear him, ye deaf; His praise, ye dumb, your loosened tongues employ" is a very close second.
it's hardly making the hymns dumber!
"hear him you deaf; His praise you dumb, your loosened tongues employ" hasn't lost any of its meaning but it is less wierd for people to sing (especially I'm guessing people who haven't grown up singing these hymns)
it often seems like the old words are more 'religious' because pretty much every other area of language has moved on.
God bless, Rich
Answer:
It gets really messy in most hymns when you attempt to "modernize" the language. You lose rhymes, you lose metre, you lose internal consistency (for example, what if you change all verb tenses ending in "-th" to their modern equivalents, but still have out-dated words like "vouchsafe" or "hitherto" or any of the other great "archaic" words that so many hymns use?), and you end up having to change so much that you've lost the beauty and charm of the original hymn, which is exactly what you were trying to bring out, not destroy.
What happens most of the time is that you'll find one word you don't like to sing, and you'll try to change it and end up with something that's even more confusing than the original, but with half the intended meaning.
Point in case, the second verse of "Come, Thou Fount:"
Here I raise mine Ebenezer, hither by Thy help I come,
And I hope by Thy good pleasure safely to arrive at home;
Jesus sought me when a stranger wandering from the fold of God,
He to rescue me from danger interposed His precious blood!
But, some change it to...
Hitherto, Thy love hath blessed me, Thou hast brought me to this place,
And I know that Thou wilt lead me safely home by Thy good grace;
Jesus sought me when a stranger wandering from the fold of God,
He to rescue me from danger bought me with His precious blood!
You lose some of the aspect of trust (which is something we have personally for God) conveyed by the words "by Thy help" and "by Thy good pleasure," and "and I hope," and replace it with a bit more of an aspect of praise (which is something God has done for us) in "Thy love hath brought me," "Thou hast brought me," and "Thou wilt lead me." The whole mood of the sentence changes from us talking about us ("I raise," "I come," "I hope") to talking about God ("Thy love," "Thou hast," "Thou wilt"); that's not necessarily a bad thing, but it's totally different from the original hymn. Furthermore, you completely decimate the meaning of the last line by using "bought me with" instead of "interposed."
In His love,
Nate
Answer:
Originally Posted by pgr181 I leave them as-is and explain obscure words or phrases - better to make people smarter than our hymns dumber. I take this approach to many things in life. I've never understood dumbing things down that can be quickly explained.
Answer:
[/quote=Nate]Hitherto, Thy love hath blessed me, Thou hast brought me to this place,
And I know that Thou wilt lead me safely home by Thy good grace;
Jesus sought me when a stranger wandering from the fold of God,
He to rescue me from danger bought me with His precious blood!
[/quote]
I agree somewhat that changing that verse to the above changes some aspects of the meaning, but I still am moved when I hear Fernando Ortega sing it. It is a change that doesn't (IMO) detract from the beauty and charm of the original hymn.
Nate
Nate