Question:
I am the worship leader for a churches youth group (have been for 3 1/2 years, went through 2 pastors and 3 youth pastors), me and another fellar lead. We have a drummer, bassist, bongo player, and violin player. I have this problem with my youth group right now. The Youth Pastor has started a 'Youth Team' (which is the same as a Youth Choir, one or two leads and 5 sing along). I hate youth choir's for every worship session. My worship style is band like. They made it so anybody who wants to sing, can. Yes that means the 12 year old girl who thinks she can sing and the 16 year old girl who is overweight and thinks shes "very popular" who CAN NOT sing. I am upset about it and voiced my opinion to Youth pastor and wife. They pulled the Pastors wife into it and said I was being "disrespectful" for "not wanting to be a team player". Then they said if I "don't like it then, tough. You can not be a part and sit in the audience." Whta should I do??? Oh, BTW I own all the sound equipment (including all cables, cords, speakers, moniters etc.) and instruments. Nobody in my 'band' likes it. Youth Pastor said they don't care who likes it. Youth group is at best 30, 20 are in Drama, 10 are going for choir, same 10 are in Drama. Most nights only 4-5 youth outside of drama or choir.
Answer:
Originally Posted by se7enband The Youth Pastor has started a 'Youth Team' (which is the same as a Youth Choir, one or two leads and 5 sing along).
Awesome... although you apparently don't think so.
I hate youth choir's for every worship session. My worship style is band like.
To be quite frank, the very fact that you say "I hate" and "my worship style" suggests that you are not humble enough to be an effective worship leader. It's not about you.
They made it so anybody who wants to sing, can.
Praise God!
Yes that means the 12 year old girl who thinks she can sing and the 16 year old girl who is overweight and thinks shes "very popular" who CAN NOT sing.
I'm not sure why you bother to mention things such as age or weight (as if they had any bearing whatsoever on singing ability), except to show that you are prejudiced towards young and overweight people. This is wrong. If people want to sing and can't sing, the solution is not to prevent them from singing, but rather to teach them how to sing and to encourage them to get better.
I am upset about it and voiced my opinion to Youth pastor and wife. They pulled the Pastors wife into it and said I was being "disrespectful" for "not wanting to be a team player". Then they said if I "don't like it then, tough. You can not be a part and sit in the audience." Whta should I do???
You should humble yourself and realize that there are reasons for your pastor's decisions besides those which you think you can see or understand. It's not about you and it's not about making you look good. If you can't get away from thinking about your own image, then you should step down as a worship leader.
Oh, BTW I own all the sound equipment (including all cables, cords, speakers, moniters etc.) and instruments.
I own a large portion of the equipment that my church uses as well. I don't see any relevance to this, however. It's not about you or what you own. My suggestion is to effectively donate whatever equipment you can afford to part with to the church. I have approximately $1,000 of equipment that I have purchased with my own money that now belongs to the church for all practical purposes. It never leaves church and is used for everything the church does. When I leave the church, the vast majority (if not all) of this equipment will stay. Why? Because the church needs it more than I do.
Nobody in my 'band' likes it. Youth Pastor said they don't care who likes it.
Likes what?
Youth group is at best 30, 20 are in Drama, 10 are going for choir, same 10 are in Drama. Most nights only 4-5 youth outside of drama or choir.
That's perfectly fine, and fairly typical. That is close to the same "statistics" of the youth group at my church. You should be encouraging people to participate rather than discouraging them.
I hope I wasn't too hard on you, but you honestly have a lot of maturing and humbling to do.
In His love,
Nate
Answer:
As a youth band we've experienced a similar thing recently. We have a new guitar player, bass player, and percussion player. The guitar player and bass player, for lack of any other terms, suck. Big time. And yet, our youth band leader insists on letting them play with us (the original band of 3 guys). Why? I don't know, but I can't question his motives of what he wants done because he's the person in authority. So we're just having to deal with it and teach them as best as we can.
The same would go for your youth choir (which, btw, most of our youth choir can't sing a lick, but they're doing it anyways). Try and teach them what to do. Don't try and fight it. I tried to fight these new members and even the existence of our choir as well. It didn't turn out too well.
Anyways, I'm sorry to say, but I think you'll just have to make the best out of the choir and since they're going to be there anyways, try and teach them.
Answer:
heh, i guess i'm lucky that i've only had to really deal with two issues like that. we had a kid on the team that loved to sing but he couldn't stay on key for a second. then we moved him to a different part of the youth group(he sets stuff up and such). and we had a guy "playing" acoustic guitar. he lacked anything that might have been even closely related to rhythm. sometimes he would even fake playing, so he was basically up there to be seen and to think he was cool 'cause he played guitar in the band. then he just stopped showing up. so now the worship team is down to 4 people. me doing guitar/vocal, our bassist, our drummer(who we could not survive without at this point, he's amazing), and a pianist(he refuses to touch the keyboard the church has, which is annoying because some of the organ patches on the keyboard would sound great with us. but he is also good. and we will be losing him as our youth group changes the day of the week that it's on.) there is an advantage to having a small team, but there is a certain power that comes from having a choir, so follow nate's instructions. they are very good. and remember, it's not about you.
Answer:
first of all its not your band
second, you didn't mention a guitar, do you work without one at all, and if so, pm me about how that goes? ( just out of curiosity)
third, i feel your pain at the same time. alot of times this is the role that gets beat up the most in a church for some reason. pray about it. question your motives. realize that the youth pastor is in charge. when i led a youth praise team i tried to make him see the fact that not everyone could participate (not everyone is muscially gifted) my goal was musical excellence unto the Lord. His goal was a method of involvement for youth, no matter what, if they were interested. it had more to do with plugging them in adn less to do with worship. i fundamentally, disagreed on that one, but in the end, his call not mine. but i couldn't keep working with it either
Answer:
Looks like every one else covered the maturity and obediance issues, so I'll just share something that took me a long time to learn. When you look at these kids don't look at how they sound to your ears, instead look at them in two way; 1) How does their voice sound to God, is it pleasing and heartfelt to whom it counts? 2) Look for the potential, and then let that drive you to help them achieve it.
There is this girl in the worship band I dirrect, I won't say any names coughAshleycough, and she couldn't sing a lick but something in the way she sang made me beleive that she could be a great singer. I've been working with her for a while now and she's sound like a friggin angel, albeit sometimes she reverts to her old sudo-tone deaf ways. Now every time she sings it makes my heart warm up.
The sign of a true leader is how well he/she follows.
Answer:
Thanks for all the answers. I forgot to mention something. This youth pastor has been so for 2 months. Him and his family (his WHOLE family, including in-laws) have been members for 4 months and have already taken over EVERY position in church (not one position is held by someone who is not). Now, Im cool with the choir now. Just had a problem with the way he brought it to me and my band.
Answer:
Originally Posted by se7enband Thanks for all the answers. I forgot to mention something. This youth pastor has been so for 2 months. Him and his family (his WHOLE family, including in-laws) have been members for 4 months and have already taken over EVERY position in church (not one position is held by someone who is not).
That is a little wierd...
Answer:
Originally Posted by se7enband me and my band.
Get over yourself.
Answer:
I could see how this would slow things down a bit, adding new people to an already "established" band. especially if they weren't the greatest of musicians. i could see a seperate, choir time working well, but this could as well. but again, this is about God, not pleasing someones ears.
make it work. teach them parts. a choir only practice might be good. have it with your guitar (assuming you play) so they have something to follow. then, when the whole band gets together, all parts are learned and thats not an issue. you've gotta work around those types of "problems". and, don't worry about sounding like the best band ever, your just there to give people one more way to worship.
Answer:
looks like you've taken the usual "humbleness" and "submission" beating. i can't imagine why you wouldn't have gotten the point by now, so here's my 2 cents, assuming you've taking the humbleness and submission advice seriously....
first of all, i think your youth pastor should recognize that some people just don't have talent in certain areas, and when God doesn't give someone talent, it's because he doesn't want them to use it. if those girls genuinely CAN'T sing, then your youth pastor should recognize that, and try his best to discover what areas they DO have giftings in, and give them opportunities to use it. i can understand your frustration in trying to work with people who just don't have talent in the area's they've been placed.
however, if practice is the issue (as in, they have potential, but they just haven't practiced their talents enough yet to be audibly recognizable as "singing"), then you should invite them to practices; let them sing in practices, learn the songs, give them parts to play in the band. but don't have them taking part in leading the services until you feel they're spiritually and musically ready.
there is a fine line we as worship leaders must walk between submission and leadership. we are placed there to lead the congregation, but to submit to the youth pastor. you SHOULD be placed in charge of the music. however, your youth pastor hasn't given you this responsibility. this tells me that either your youth pastor is at fault for not recognizing where your talents are and what responsibilities you have, OR that he does recognize that you just aren't ready for that kind of responsibility.
as i was saying, to keep things orderly (and sonically decent), you (or your youth pastor) should look for and pick out the people that have talents in certain areas, and work on developing those gifts. if those girls can't sing, and you have no hope that they will ever have that ability, then tell THAT to your youth pastor. but don't you think it's quite immature of you to tell your youth pastor that she shouldn't be up there at all, because she's fat and unpopular and can't sing?
sit down with your youth pastor and discuss this. discuss who has talent, and in what areas. discuss who has potential, whos potential needs developing, and who has potential that can be used right now.
but first, you should take the other advice that's been given into serious consideration. worry about yourself as an individual, and a leader. then you'll be able to take on the responsibility of leadership. not before.
like Nate said, (and we're trying to be constructive here), it sounds like you have some maturing and humbling to do first. you need to trust that your youth pastor knows what's best, and even if he doesn't...it's your spiritual duty to submit to him regardless of whether or not he knows what he's doing. God will bless that.
Answer:
Heres how first pratice went. Our bands practice time is 5:00 pm on Wednesdays. Drama practice is at 6:30. Now Worship Choir practice is at 5:30pm (same room and equipment). My fellow bandmembers and I asked that they move it to 6:00, since they only practice 1 song a night. That would give our band 1 hr to practice 4-6 songs and them 30 min. to practice 1 song or part of song. They said 'No'. Then they told me "we dont want you to play guitar anymore, just the youth pastors nephew (whom I am better than). You just sing backup and maybe lead to 2nd verse or something, ok?" Then they told my drummer that he would be alternating with another begginer drummer, weither he liked it or not. My brother (bassist) wants to leave, and drummer wants to leave. Violin and bongo players have already left.
Oh...and his aunt is now the 'Youth Worship Director', I no longer have control over ANYTHING.
What do I do? Im under presure from band members to leave, Im believing God for annointing, Im offended and hurt, and already this has caused 2 members to leave (when I say leave I mean not take part in choir, but take part in our band which functions outside of church).
P.S. I AM 'OVER MYSELF' ITS NOT ABOUT ME!!!!
Answer:
If it is a situation where you are not able to joyfully serve the Lord, you should considered removing yourself from it.
I'm not one to say "just give up on the situation", but if you don't feel that you are honoring God in what is going on, it may be time to step back for awhile.
And hey, if your band plays outside of church, why not just jam there, and serve God that way?
Honestly, it sounds like both you and the people in charge need to evaluate your motives. I really don't want to rip on you here, that is not my intention.
There is a place in the world for good guitarists and the best singers. That is the performing world. There is also a place for good musicians with a humble heart to servce God. That is the church.
Answer:
honestly. do you think that maybe a youth "band" is the only way your youth group can worship? having 20 people in drama and 10 people in choir just tell us one thing. Their way of worshiping God is through Drama, and well.. choir. Im not trying to beat you down here and say that whats happening is totally fair. But you have to realize that your way of doing things, may not be God's way of doing things. I must say that sometimes I get carried away thinking my way is God's way, and I'm quite glad that God gives me a holy smack in the face and tell's me that im wrong. Just talk to your youth pastor, express your concerns, LISTEN to his concerns, and most importantly pray about it.
one last thing... It strikes me that you would point out bad singing as a result of someones age or weight and even popularity. Personally it upset me. Let me just tell you something that might change your opinion. Last summer I led worship at a few bible camps. One camp, Senior Teen Camp, had a kid who was handicapped and by no means was the most popular there. He came up to me and told me he really wanted to sing a song, and personally, I just felt I had to say yes. Just let me tell you something. He sang, "Here I Am to Worship", and by the end of that song, I along with so many others was fighting back tears. It wasn't perfect, but he gave all he had for God and Im sure that God looked down at him and said, "That's what true worship is." So before you point at people and say that they can't worship because of their voice, shape or age. Think about where their hearts are. Worship isn't about hitting the perfect note or the perfect looking person, its about setting aside all other things and embracing God with our whole hearts.
Answer:
Originally Posted by se7enband Heres how first pratice went. Our bands practice time is 5:00 pm on Wednesdays. Drama practice is at 6:30. Now Worship Choir practice is at 5:30pm (same room and equipment). My fellow bandmembers and I asked that they move it to 6:00, since they only practice 1 song a night. That would give our band 1 hr to practice 4-6 songs and them 30 min. to practice 1 song or part of song. They said 'No'. Then they told me "we dont want you to play guitar anymore, just the youth pastors nephew (whom I am better than). You just sing backup and maybe lead to 2nd verse or something, ok?" Then they told my drummer that he would be alternating with another begginer drummer, weither he liked it or not. My brother (bassist) wants to leave, and drummer wants to leave. Violin and bongo players have already left.
Oh...and his aunt is now the 'Youth Worship Director', I no longer have control over ANYTHING.
What do I do? Im under presure from band members to leave, Im believing God for annointing, Im offended and hurt, and already this has caused 2 members to leave (when I say leave I mean not take part in choir, but take part in our band which functions outside of church).
P.S. I AM 'OVER MYSELF' ITS NOT ABOUT ME!!!!
i had a really long response typed up for this, and my computer locked up.
basically, it still doesn't seem like you really are over yourself. it seems like you're trying to give the impression that your youth leaders have no clue what they're doing. you seem to think that you "deserve" to be up there, and all of the time, because YOU think you're better than everyone else that wants to play. you're pretty upset that you don't have "control" anymore too.
maybe your youth leaders are doing this to put you and your band members in your place, and to humble you. to be completely honest, i might do the same thing in their place, if my impressions are correct.
i don't like to make assumptions, but i don't think i'm assuming too much when i say that you're not making it sound like your focus is really on God. it sounds like you're upset that you're not in control of things, and that you don't think anyone else deserves to play or have as much control as you over the "band".
please take this as constructive criticism. that's what my intention is.
Submit, and God will bless you and your band. But not until you start submitting to those the Lord has placed in authority over you. How can you say it's about God, when you aren't willing to submit to the authority figures God has placed in your life?