Question:
Lately a lot of small things have been bothering me that used to never bother me. It's like if things are not done the way I think they should be done, I go crazy. The other day Someone dropped a napkin on the floor and I wanted to walk over and pick it up. I almost went insane over it and I finally walked by and picked it up. Other things like when people run late and misplace items makes me go crazy as well. In fact, a few weeks ago, I had an anxiety attack because things weren't going the way I wanted them to. I don't want to be like this and I want God to change it but I was wondering if any of you could give me some practical ideas to help me.
Answer:
You might look into Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder. Most people have some kind of obsession (being bothered by the napkin, or by disorder) or compulsion (an act that relieves the obsession). For me, it's disorder or uncertainty; I also can't stand it if things on a desk or something are not all lined up geometrically. These things aren't severe enough to have drastic effects on my life, and it's the same way for many other people, but not all.

In other words, you could have stronger than normal symptoms of OCD. I would reccomend getting a visit to your doctor to see if it's really a concern or not.
Answer:
Shredcheddar could be right, but maybe not, I've seen people before who don't have it but act this way, sometimes its because they aren't very happy or because they feel like they don't have control over things.
I think what helps is just standing/sitting still sometimes and to just relax and give all your worries to God.
I would just pray to God that he gives you patience and just to help you relax.
God Bless!
Answer:
Originally Posted by Shredcheddar You might look into Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder. Most people have some kind of obsession (being bothered by the napkin, or by disorder) or compulsion (an act that relieves the obsession). For me, it's disorder or uncertainty; I also can't stand it if things on a desk or something are not all lined up geometrically. These things aren't severe enough to have drastic effects on my life, and it's the same way for many other people, but not all.

In other words, you could have stronger than normal symptoms of OCD. I would reccomend getting a visit to your doctor to see if it's really a concern or not.
It seems that if someone is obsessing over something, seeing a docter would not help. It is a matter of the mind and heart. I would sonner call this kind of obsession "sin" and deal with it accordingly.
What is an obsession? It is something all your thoughts revolve around, you have trouble thinking about anything else. Over time those things have to be controlled by you, in essence they become needs. You need to have something a certain way, you feel incomplete if you don't have control, almost like one would feel by missing a meal. Being an obsessive person you tend to be self-centered, everyone else must cater to how you think things should be done, how you want things to look, act, etc. This is inherantly selfish.
Living with an obsessive person tends to be somewhat miserable. Over time they start to freak out about the smallest things. They lack joy, peace, and so busy are they trying to control everything that they forget about God who has numbered even the hairs on there head. What is there to worry about when you are resting in God's mighty hand?! And JBanana, I'm not saying your like this. But know that this is what it can lead to.
How do you fight it? Rest fully in the sovereignty of God. Trust Him with the small details. Deliberately try to serve other people, attend to their needs and desires. Learn to differentiate between the trivial and the important. When plans go astray, or things lose their place don't worry or fret. Just do what you need to do to fix things... and have a little fun while your at it.
Answer:
Right, I could be wrong, or simply jumping to conclusions too quickly; however, there's still a possibility.

Originally Posted by trhoke It seems that if someone is obsessing over something, seeing a docter would not help. It is a matter of the mind and heart. I would sonner call this kind of obsession "sin" and deal with it accordingly.
You would sooner call an obsession over disorder or being bothered by something sinful than simply recognize OCD as a legitimate disorder? Can you support that this type of obsession is sinful?

What is an obsession? It is something all your thoughts revolve around, you have trouble thinking about anything else.
There are obviously varying degrees of obsession, and the cause of this obsession is also important. In the case of a psychological disorder such as OCD, I don't think your assessment of "obsession" should apply. When someone in good health voluntarily obsesses in the way you mean, I think it is approaching sinfulness. However, when somebody is naturally inclined to obsess or cannot control their obsessions, I would call this principle into question.

Being an obsessive person you tend to be self-centered, everyone else must cater to how you think things should be done, how you want things to look, act, etc. This is inherantly selfish.
Being obsessive isn't inherently selfish. You can be just as obsessed over some humble, selfless goal as a selfish one. I think you're exaggerating what exactly "obsessing" entails.

How do you fight it? Rest fully in the sovereignty of God. Trust Him with the small details. Deliberately try to serve other people, attend to their needs and desires. Learn to differentiate between the trivial and the important. When plans go astray, or things lose their place don't worry or fret. Just do what you need to do to fix things... and have a little fun while your at it.
I agree that faith in God's soverignty is an important part of any struggle, but I do not reccomend replacing prayer alone in the stead of medical examination and treatment. We have doctors and medical professionals for a reason. Let me ask you this: is it sinful to seek medical help in this situation?
Answer:
Originally Posted by Shredcheddar Right, I could be wrong, or simply jumping to conclusions too quickly; however, there's still a possibility.

You would sooner call an obsession over disorder or being bothered by something sinful than simply recognize OCD as a legitimate disorder? Can you support that this type of obsession is sinful?
I think in this day and age we have the tendency to labal behavioral problems as disorders.
Is this obsession sinful? Being so wrapped up in something that you worry and fret all the time. Or you have to be the one in control, you have to fashion things the way you want them... yeah I would call that sinful.

There are obviously varying degrees of obsession, and the cause of this obsession is also important. In the case of a psychological disorder such as OCD, I don't think your assessment of "obsession" should apply. When someone in good health voluntarily obsesses in the way you mean, I think it is approaching sinfulness. However, when somebody is naturally inclined to obsess or cannot control their obsessions, I would call this principle into question.
I would challenge the idea that someone cannot control themselves in whatever way. If I "cannot" control myself and hit everyone I see, would you treat that medically? Just because you are naturally inclined to do something doesn't neccesarily mean that it is beyond your control. All of us are naturally inclined to do certain things. Often, those things are not good behaviors, e.g. lazy, aggressive, etc. What we need is discipline, not medical attention.

Being obsessive isn't inherently selfish. You can be just as obsessed over some humble, selfless goal as a selfish one. I think you're exaggerating what exactly "obsessing" entails.
Granted the object of one's obsession would determine whether or not it is sinful. But note when I said "This is inherently selfish" I was referring back to what I described in the same paragraph.
The strength of the word "obsession" should not be forgotten. It's a persistent tendency to occupy your thoughts with a person or thing usually to unreasonable degree's. Obsession can be over something small and trivial, and only eat up part of your life. But, if it's not dealt with it can swallow up the rest. I'll grant you that not all obsessions are sinful, but one should be careful over things that control your mind to such a degree.
I agree that faith in God's soverignty is an important part of any struggle, but I do not reccomend replacing prayer alone in the stead of medical examination and treatment. We have doctors and medical professionals for a reason. Let me ask you this: is it sinful to seek medical help in this situation?
No, it's not sinful, but possible isn't the right "treatment" called for (so to speak). I would be slow in seeking medical attention for what I think is a behavioral issue.
Btw, what would the treatment entail?
Answer:
First of all, I still maintain my position on whether or not this behavior is sinful. You still have yet to give me a Biblical stance asserting that your statement that "this behavior is sinful" is true.

Anyways, it's really quite irrelevant to the discussion. I want to re-ask my last question: What is wrong with seeking medical help in this situation? You don't, by chance, subscribe to all the "Jesus is the great physician, so we shouldn't consult doctors" junk do you?

Originally Posted by trhoke No, it's not sinful, but possible isn't the right "treatment" called for (so to speak). I would be slow in seeking medical attention for what I think is a behavioral issue.
Well, I think the medical community would disagree with you. I also don't see what's wrong with treating behavioral issues medically. The point is to solve the problem, and whether that happens by medical means or self-control (if in fact self-control is reasonable or even possible), I don't really care. Why not seek help where you can?

Btw, what would the treatment entail?
I'm not a medical professional, but feel free to do a quick Google search on the topic and I'm sure you'd be provided with much information on the subject.
Answer:
Originally Posted by Shredcheddar First of all, I still maintain my position on whether or not this behavior is sinful. You still have yet to give me a Biblical stance asserting that your statement that "this behavior is sinful" is true.

Anyways, it's really quite irrelevant to the discussion. I want to re-ask my last question: What is wrong with seeking medical help in this situation? You don't, by chance, subscribe to all the "Jesus is the great physician, so we shouldn't consult doctors" junk do you?
No, if I broke a bone I would definetly go to a doctor. I'll get into scriptural backing later, although I don't want to divert this thread from it's main purpose.

Well, I think the medical community would disagree with you. I also don't see what's wrong with treating behavioral issues medically. The point is to solve the problem, and whether that happens by medical means or self-control (if in fact self-control is reasonable or even possible), I don't really care. Why not seek help where you can?
Honestly, I'm not to concerned about the medical community. The bible is clear that the cure for "behavioral" problems is being transformed by the renewing of our minds, and being conformed to the image of Christ. Wheras the medical community thinks the cure for a hyperactive child, is a drug. The cure for aggression, a drug. Being obsessive, a drug. I very leary of anything that controls how I act, my moods, etc. I am supposed to beat my body and make it my slave.
Anyway. Jbanana, however you decide to handle this, my prayers are with you. Let the peace and grace of Christ dwell in your heart.
Answer:
You still have to make a case that a natural inclination towards a particular obsession is sinful. For example, I am diagnosed with Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder, symptoms of which being that I cannot do anything or go anywhere without washing or somehow cleansing my hands. Can you demonstrate that this (or some other example of OCD) is sinful?

Also, given the status of OCD, do you expect those affected by this disorder to overcome their own anxieties by their own power even if it has been shown medically that they are unable to do so because of their disorder? I just don't see why, even if these obsessions are sinful, the only way to cure them is to "renew their minds." Why not procure medical help?

Originally Posted by The Wikipedia article An estimated two to three percent of the population of the United States is thought to have OCD or display OCD-like symptoms. Because of the condition's personal nature, and the stigma that surrounds it, there may be many unaccounted-for OCD sufferers, and the above percentages could be even higher. The typical OCD sufferer performs tasks (or compulsions) to seek relief from obsessions. To others, these tasks may appear simple and unnecessary. But for the sufferer, such tasks can feel critically important, and must be performed in particular ways for fear of dire consequences and to stop the stress build up. Examples of these tasks: repeatedly checking that one's parked car has been locked before leaving it; turning lights on and off a set number of times before exiting a room; repeatedly washing hands at regular intervals throughout the day.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obsessi...lsive_disorder
Apparently, for the individual sufferer, overcoming one's symptoms is not simply as easy as deciding not to worry about things. This is why I think exception should be made to sufferers of OCD, especially when their obsessions and compulsions are not morally reprehensible, but are only exaggerated episodes of petty precautions that every normal person takes.

As for practical advice, here it is: I actually just finished talking to my dad about this issue (he walked in and asked why I was reading about OCD). He actually struggles with some symptoms of OCD, and for a while was struggling as to whether or not to get medical treatment. The elders of the church he prayed with encouraged him to get medical help for the problem, and he's currently still taking medication and is greatly pleased with the result it has had. He still prays and asks God for help in controlling his obsessions and compulsions, but does in fact take medication. This, I believe, is the best way to tackle this issue. We're arguing over whether to simply rely on God or take medication, but in reality I think this issue is best resolved by turning to both resources as a help. Once again, if you think compulsions and obsessions are sinful even in spite of the nature of OCD, why not get help where you can?
Answer:
it seems to me that overall you are considering yourself responsible for things you have little or no control over and with the pettiest things out of place your subconscience is bothering you about it.
i wouldnt rush to the latest medical science to try to solve this issue since they will be overly hasty to perscribe you a medication with pestering side effects.
just relax first. remember sabbath means rest and celebration. take breaks.
if this doesnt help get out a piece of paper and logic your way through this.
1. What am i responsible for?
2. What do i have control over?
3. Do i have any responsibilities that i have no control over?
4. Am i becoming responsible for other people's issues?
i used to be fairly obsessive about things until i realized that all i can do is make the best choices i can with the best information i have. to require anyhting more from a person is not fair.
so when there is a napkin on my nerves thats on the ground i can just say to myself, that does not concern me.
-ben mordecai (myspace.com/benitosuave)
Answer:
If you sit and stare at a napkin on the floor and think about how much you want to pick it up, then of course it's gonna drive you crazy. I mean, your situation sounds much more intense, but it still seems like the general principle that dwelling on something produces obsession with that thing is at work here.
Answer:
Originally Posted by JBanana Lately a lot of small things have been bothering me that used to never bother me. It's like if things are not done the way I think they should be done, I go crazy. The other day Someone dropped a napkin on the floor and I wanted to walk over and pick it up. I almost went insane over it and I finally walked by and picked it up. Other things like when people run late and misplace items makes me go crazy as well. In fact, a few weeks ago, I had an anxiety attack because things weren't going the way I wanted them to. I don't want to be like this and I want God to change it but I was wondering if any of you could give me some practical ideas to help me. You're 17, right?
From personal experience, I would venture to say that you're simply changing, mentally and physically, and your brain is going out of whack. Don't worry about it, it won't last long.
Like the Bible says it "came to pass" (Psalm 105:19).
Answer:
What is an obsession? It is something all your thoughts revolve around, you have trouble thinking about anything else. Over time those things have to be controlled by you, in essence they become needs. You need to have something a certain way, you feel incomplete if you don't have control, almost like one would feel by missing a meal. Being an obsessive person you tend to be self-centered, everyone else must cater to how you think things should be done, how you want things to look, act, etc. This is inherantly selfish.
This is EXACTLY how I feel.
Living with an obsessive person tends to be somewhat miserable. Over time they start to freak out about the smallest things. They lack joy, peace, and so busy are they trying to control everything that they forget about God who has numbered even the hairs on there head. What is there to worry about when you are resting in God's mighty hand?! And JBanana, I'm not saying your like this. But know that this is what it can lead to. This is what I am becoming. I don't want to be like this and I know that God has everything in control but it's hard when the smallest things drive me insane.
Answer:
Originally Posted by Shredcheddar You still have to make a case that a natural inclination towards a particular obsession is sinful. For example, I am diagnosed with Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder, symptoms of which being that I cannot do anything or go anywhere without washing or somehow cleansing my hands. Can you demonstrate that this (or some other example of OCD) is sinful?
One of the fruits of the spirit is self-control. If you cannot control yourself, if you are a slave to your tendencies, then you are not exercising self-control. This is what I think is sinful. It's not neccesarily what your doing, it's the fact that you cannot control what your doing.
Also, given the status of OCD, do you expect those affected by this disorder to overcome their own anxieties by their own power even if it has been shown medically that they are unable to do so because of their disorder? I just don't see why, even if these obsessions are sinful, the only way to cure them is to "renew their minds." Why not procure medical help?
I said nothing about dealing with this on "their own power". Medical studies are limited, they see human behavioral issues and they seek to resolve them from a man-centered point of view. They try to fix the problems of the heart and mind, the way they would solve problems with our body. But, the true problem is something they're medicine can't touch, and that's our sinful nature. The only remedy for our sin nature is God at work in our hearts.

[quote]Apparently, for the individual sufferer, overcoming one's symptoms is not simply as easy as deciding not to worry about things. This is why I think exception should be made to sufferers of OCD, especially when their obsessions and compulsions are not morally reprehensible, but are only exaggerated episodes of petty precautions that every normal person takes.
Again, it's the lack of self-control that I'm concerned with.
As for practical advice, here it is: I actually just finished talking to my dad about this issue (he walked in and asked why I was reading about OCD). He actually struggles with some symptoms of OCD, and for a while was struggling as to whether or not to get medical treatment. The elders of the church he prayed with encouraged him to get medical help for the problem, and he's currently still taking medication and is greatly pleased with the result it has had. He still prays and asks God for help in controlling his obsessions and compulsions, but does in fact take medication. This, I believe, is the best way to tackle this issue. We're arguing over whether to simply rely on God or take medication, but in reality I think this issue is best resolved by turning to both resources as a help. Once again, if you think compulsions and obsessions are sinful even in spite of the nature of OCD, why not get help where you can?
It's not so much, "either rely on God, or take medication." It's whether or not medication even has a place in the equation.
Now, are people who would be diagnosed OCD--who don't have access to medical resources--destined to continue in there ways? How did Christians in the past handle a lack of self-control? Or had hyper-active children? Or had overly aggressive children? A combination of discipline, training in righteousness (i.e. how to live rightly), correction, and the rod (obviously this one would not apply to adults who are struggling with lack of self control. ).
My point is this: behavioral issues have been dealt with since the fall, and God has given us everything we need to deal with these issues through the Spirit, Scripture, other believers, leaders in Church, parents, etc. I don't believe these issues fall in the sphere of medicine, thus the medical option should not be approached. I believe there is a distinction then between medical practices that seek to control behavior, and the more orthodox/traditional practices to heal the body.
Answer:
Originally Posted by JBanana This is EXACTLY how I feel.
This is what I am becoming. I don't want to be like this and I know that God has everything in control but it's hard when the smallest things drive me insane.
I think benitosuave's advice was very good. In that you remind yourself what you are responsible for, and to try not to worry about the things that you aren't.
In all this, we must avoid simply trying to overcome something through our own will power. This path leads only to frustration and despair. What you must realize is that what your becoming is ultimately going to hinder your relationship with God. You will never be able to fully delight in God and all that He is, if you are always trying to take the reins. In essence your saying that your not willing to trust Him, even in the small details of life. The death of sin lies in the delight of God. So remind yourself, not only what your responsible for, but what God is responsible for.
When plans go awry, when people are late, when napkins fall to the ground, when life seems to unravel like a ball of yarn racing down a cliff, know this: That God is ultimately responsible. For He is working out all things for the good of those who love Him and are called according to His purpose. You don't have to be in control, because God is. Redeem this situation, use it to know more of who God is. Delight and glory in His strength, be enthralled by His power and love, dedicate yourself to giving Him your all. In this, God's strength will be made manifest in your weaknesses.