Question:
So it's become clear to me over the last few years that I am not a Christian. Well, maybe I am, but I don't really know. I was baptized and confirmed at a Lutheran church that i've belonged to for 18 years. In the last 4 or 5 years, I've gone only to Easter and Christmas services.. plus maybe a couple more (Lent, etc.) but really only because it's something i've always done with my mom.
My mom is very Christian .. she plays piano and sings for the church, and i'd swear she spends every waking moment that she isn't teaching piano at home or taking care of my sisters practicing for church, at church, or something else church related. She got me a wonderful Bible for my confirmation, but I have yet to read it (outside of what I had read in Sunday School).
My dad had never really gone to church with us as a family (they are divorced now), but after meeting another very Christian woman on a christian online dating service and almost getting married to her, he is now starting to go to church on a regular basis.
My brother, who had never been very Christian (from what I know, and i know him well), is considering being a chaplin (sp?) in for the Army when he has to serve after ROTC from what I understand. He doesn't share it with me all that much, maybe because he's aware of my situation, or maybe for other reasons, but I'm pretty sure he has a relationship with God on one level or another.
My sister often goes to youth group and retreats with the church, but I suspect it is largely due to the social nature as she often throws a fit (she's in those teenage fit-throwing-for-no-reason years) if my mom wants her to go to church... maybe she just needs her sleep and doesn't want to get up. That's my excuse most of the time.. i'm usually exhausted from work and school and homework.. but that's something else to worry about.
I guess after all that background I should get to the problem ... I don't know what I am. I can't consider myself Christian on any level remotely close to what I read here. I can't outright say I talk with God, or that i've seen any definite signs from God, or that I can even acknowledge some sort of relationship with God. I'm just not that passionate... and it isn't that I don't want to be or that I do want to be.. it's that I simply haven't found some kind of reason for me to be that way. When I talk to my mom about it she becomes so emotional and passionate about her relationship with God and it usually ends with "I guess I just don't understand yet." or "Ohhh kevin I guess you just don't understand yet.. i'm sorry honey."
I've had the same conversation with the woman my dad almost (should have) married. She is like a second mom to me, and she is also very strong in her beliefs. She's been through so much, I can understand why. I can't count the number of open heart surgeries she's been through, the bypasses, stints, and whatever else she's got inside her. She's been through a lot, and I can understand how she has such a strong faith.
Me on the other hand.. i've often contemplated writing a book titled "Painfully Normal." Basically I don't really feel that anything in my life is extremely out of the ordinary.. i'm about as normal a guy as you can find. And while i'd love to be more active with the church youth group (it seems like it would be fun), i feel like i'd be extremely out of place and there for all the wrong reasons... when things came up in the group conversations that involved talking about the bible or life stories or people's open relationships with God, I couldn't respond in any meaningful way. I almost feel like i'd be shunned.
I feel like I could go on and on with this post, but I won't.
So how do you all so openly and strongly profess your faith in God? Was it something that happened to you? Everybody talks about the time they were "saved" ... i would Love to know what this means or maybe some stories. I just don't know what I am. I wouldn't say i'm atheist.. or Christian.. I believe in something, I just don't know what or why.
If ya made it this far
Thanks,
-Kevin
Answer:
You may think "yeah right" when I say this, but I understand completely what you're talking about. I've been there too. Getting more involved isn't really the answer to your problems. The directions are rarely ever that direct. What can I offer to help? Aside from the little things not much. Read your Bible, pray, but not like you may be thinking. Read a little bit at a time. A lot of Bibles are cut into individual sections and stories. Try one of those as often as you can (I can't say every day because that'd be asking more of you than of myself ). Pray just a few sentences. Father, help me to see you and understand you more. Something simple like that. You've gotta crawl before you can walk.
1 Corinthians 3:1,2
Brothers, I could not address you as spiritual but as worldly–mere infants in Christ. I gave you milk, not solid food, for you were not yet ready for it. Indeed, you are still not ready.
Paul, possibly one of the wisest (IMO) of all the apostles, didn't expect everyone to be up to his stage of maturity in Christ. Nor can anyone flat out expect that of you. You're still an infant. You just need to grow. But to do that, you need to be nourished. The only way to grow in Christ is with the word. Feed yourself the milk, grow and someday you may be able to have those great, emotional discussions about God like your mom.
Good luck.
Answer:
i didnt find Jesus in my heart untill MANY years of going to church with my parents; but then i joined a youth group because i loved their music, and slowly i became very devoted to my faith, and in all honesty, i swear i felt the spirt at an actual moment, it wasnt gradual, it was just out of nowhere....
it was the most amazing turning point of me life!
Answer:
Dude, dont base how you percieve yourself or your relationship with God on your family.
Heaps of people when it comes to relationships with God compare themselves to others, and then because they feel they fall short of the other people, they think they can't possibly be a christian.
Most of us, at the moment of conversion, there is no bright light shinning on our heads, there are no angels standing around, there is no voice from heaven, there is simply a decision in our hearts, to give our lives to God.
Its that simple.
I have met people who do amazing things for God who are not passionate in a conventional sense. We often attribute passion to an emotional feeling, or the showing of emotion (eg. crying etc) but thats not it. Passion can take many different forms.
Think of Daniel from the Old Testament. The way he showed his passion, was firstly thru service to the King (secular kingdom), a selfless service, and by standing up for what he believed in. Their are many different ways to show passion. Juts because you dont feel like crying or whatever when you talk about God, doesnt mean you cant be passionate Him. Being passionate about Him is a choice!
Answer:
Hey Kevin,
Don't get yourself too worked up over this. After all, being a Christian isn't about all the superficial stuff. It's not what you do, or how you act, or even what you say. IT'S WHAT YOU BELIEVE !
When Jesus was asked what God expected of us, He said simply to "believe in the One He has sent". So the real question to ask yourself is " What do I believe?" If you can say, without a doubt, that you believe that Jesus came to Earth as the True Son of God, was Crucified and died for the sins of the whole world, (that includes all of your sins, too) was laid in a tomb and Resurrected three days later, then you're almost there. To be saved simply means that not only do you believe these things, but you accept the free gifts that God is offering to you, His total forgiveness of your sins (past, present and future), His total acceptance of you as His Beloved Child, and His promise that you will live with Him for all eternity in the place He has prepared for all who Believe in Him and accept His Sacrifice.
That's all there is to it, really. We only need to believe and accept. He will do the rest by putting desires to reach out to Him and serve Him and each other into our hearts. You may also feel drawn to His Word and actually want to read the Bible.
So it's all a question of what you believe and what you are ready to do with that belief. If you truly want Him to come into your life and BE your life, you simply pray and ask Him. He'll be there to Save you from an eternity without Him. That's what Salvation is.
Hope this helps. Need anything more, PM me. I may not have all the answers, but I know Some One Who does.
God Bless You Kevin.
Paul
Answer:
So it's become clear to me over the last few years that I am not a Christian. Well, maybe I am, but I don't really know.
Kevin being Christian is not about going ot church and what have you thogh they are all things that are improtant for beleivers to do.
Being Christian is about whehter or not you have placed your faith int he death burial and physical resurrection for your sins. If you have don ethat youa re a Christian--just not a verey obedient one.
Go to youtrh group--give it time and let it grow on you. Don't worry so mush about your feelings--do the right things because they are the right things to do whether they feel like it ornot. Passion is a response to behavior and behavior is a response to serve what we choose to obey.
Choose to serve the living God and obey HIm and passion will come when it is needed. And what is wrong with bweing painfully normal???
Answer:
Kevin-
I went through something similar a few years ago. Please PM me, I'd love to talk to you more about this.
As far as advice goes, I applaud your courage to post here. It shows you really do desire a relationship with God, which is a huge first step. I would encourage you, as others already have, to be in the Word often, if only a few verses at a time, as well as in prayer - doesn't have to be anything complex, just a simple, "Lord, help me know You." Babysteps.
Again, please feel free to PM me if you want to discuss anything further.
_Epaphras
Answer:
Kevin,
You say you don't know what you are. It sounds like you are a person who has been around religion for a long time, but has never actually reached out to God for yourself.
Now, it is one thing to believe. And you probably know all the stuff..that Jesus died on the cross for your sins, and He rose again, etc. Right?
(If you aren't sure about this stuff, then stop me here cause this has to be there before you can go on to what I'm about to write below.)
But from that point on Kevin, a lot of this is up to you. It's not about whether you're "normal" or not. A lot of unemotional and very normal people have some serious relationship with God going for them. The question is, if you believe that Jesus died on the cross and loves you and wants a relationship with you, then will you pursue Him and learn how to walk with Him?
This has very little to do with feeling any emotions, or going to church. What this has to do with is a spiritual law:
What you put in, is what you get out. (In the Bible the way this is put is, "What you sow is what you reap.)
So, if you go about your day and you never talk to God, never ask Him about stuff, never read the Bible, never think about Him or write down thoughts you are having towards him, never hang out with any friends who know Him and talk about Him and love Him..in short, if you put nothing in, you will get nothing out.
Jesus is a well of living water. I'm sure you heard that before. The question is whether or not everyday you'll make a conscious effort to "drink" from that well. Will you reach out to God? Will you learn how to obey Him and love Him? Will you learn to get serious about looking at the sin that He convicts you of and then learn what He is like as He walks you through forgiving you and teaching you how He thinks about you?
It's not about "what you are" as much as what you are pursuing. The Bible says that if you seek God with all your heart, you will find Him. When you are finding Him, you probably will carry yourself and express yourself a lot differently than your mom or others do. Each of us has our own personality and our own way of sharing or getting excited about knowing God. But, if you seek Him you will find Him. That goes for "normal" people like you, too.
I'm glad you asked this question. It says that you aren't happy to be on the outside looking in, to see that others are having something go down between them and God while you are just empty and haven't really found him yet. Maybe you know He is there, and have turned your life to Him (or maybe you haven't - and if you haven't, you need to!) But, either way, there is more to do in your relationship with God than just "growing up going to church" or just "believing in God." He is meant to be lived! He is meant to be experienced!
ANd it is your job to figure out what that means - keep reaching out, keep asking questions, keep seeking HIs face.
The promise of God in the Bible is that if you draw near to Him, He will draw near to you. Even if you're "normal"
heather
Answer:
Originally Posted by Kevin071586 So how do you all so openly and strongly profess your faith in God? Was it something that happened to you? Everybody talks about the time they were "saved" ... i would Love to know what this means or maybe some stories.
-Kevin
Kevin,
I could send you my whole long life story including things that have happened to me that got me into believing in God, but aside from that, you might want to check out the "Testimony" folder on CGR for other peoples' stories.
I'm realizing though, after i wrote my last post, that you are really asking us here, "What is the first step? What was the first step like for you?" You even asked us what it means to be saved.
So I don't want to give you the 2nd step (everything I wrote in my last post, above) without giving you the 1st step
So, here we go! I'm SOO glad you are asking us this!
Saved means that God has rescued you from yourself, sin, and the devil.
Here's what I mean: Everyone is born into this world disconnected from God. You feel that, don't you. You sense a disconnect. Because of our disconnection, we live out of our own desires and because of our disconnect, many of our desires are wrong.. what God would call, sin. And we are also open prey for the devil to screw with our lives big time.
All of us sin, and sin just makes the disconnect worse and worse. I'm sure you've done things you knew were wrong. I'm sure too that deep inside you still feel a sense of guilt or needing to "hide" from things you did that you know weren't right, even if they seem like "little" things. You might try to make yourself feel that what you did wasn't that bad, really, or you might try to figure it was a long time ago and not important anymore, but when you do those things (what the Bible calls "excusing" yourself..) you are really actually just trying to "hide" from the fact that you know you really have done things that were sin and that you, yourself, are a sinner in God's eyes.
That sense of needing to "hide" will also keep you, in some sense, hiding from God whether you really know it or not. And if you are hiding from Him, its impossible to get near Him.
When Jesus died on the cross, God placed on Him all the sin that you have ever done..every wrong thing. He not only placed the wrong things you DID on Jesus, but He also placed YOU on Jesus...because it's not just that you do wrong things..its that deep inside there is this sinful thing that MAKES you do wrong things. So Jesus carried your guilt, and YOU, in His very own body, stepping into the place of punishment before God that YOU deserved, and then went through the suffering of getting beaten and killed, to be punished for all that you are and all that you have ever done that was wrong.
That's a real heavy thing to think about, isn't it.
It's like Jesus saw you standing on the highway with a truck coming, and jumped in your place to push you out of the way. But it's worse than that. It's more like you got AIDS from being irresponsible and sleeping with a million people, and Jesus decided that even though it was totally your fault, that He'd swap blood with you and take your AIDS virus and die from it, and leave you totally clean.
It's pretty darn heavy.
I grew up believing in God and Jesus and could talk about Jesus dying on the cross without any sense of it being any big deal. I heard it so often it was just like, "Yeah, of course He died for me. That's just what he does, right?"
But a few years ago, I was totally sick of myself. I fell into doing things that I couldn't believe I would have done, and knew what a real loser I was. And THEN, God sent a friend to tell me this all over again in a way I never heard it before, and THEN it sunk in and I suddenly was confronted with how all the evil inside ME was what Jesus willingly decided to be punished for. And I was just overwhelmed. For the first time in my whole life, the whole idea seemed staggering, and for weeks I just went around asking, "Why? Why would He do that for me? Why? I don't deserve Him to give me His life for mine, I'm just a screw up and He's perfect. Why would He give me everything He struggled so hard all his life to hold onto - a pure record in God's sight, and swap that for my screwy record with God? What an unbelievable gift! But who am I to Him that He would even care about me, let alone give His whole self for me? " It was just waaay intimate. Who on earth would do that? Would you be willing to go down to a jail right now and say, "Let that murderer go free, I'll sit in the electric chair in his place even though I never murdered anyone?" I sure wouldn't! But that's what Jesus did for you and me! Isn't that just so out there?
Let it sink in... Let this really penetrate you. If it still doesn't mean much to you, tell God to help it register. Ask for Him to help you grasp how much He loves you to do this outlandishly crazy thing for you.
And then, here's the beginning step and the way to be saved. You have to tell God, "Wow. I am amazed that you would do such a thing for me. I don't want to turn that gift away. I take it. I'll take your life for mine, Jesus. I accept this gift and I won't throw it back in your face. Thank you for dying for me Lord Jesus."
You put it in your own words. I'm just giving you an example. You need to RECEIVE Jesus and His gift into your being, into your soul, into your heart and your spirit. Let this whole deal sink into you, and reach out and accept this gift from Him.
Part of the gift then is admitting to Him that you really are a sinner and your sin is what He suffered for. Let it affect you then. Let it affect you enough to realize that you caused his pain that you decide to do what the Bible calls "repent." That means, you decide to place your OWN life in God's hands and become His servant, His slave. Your self-focused life is over... He gave you His life, give yours back to Him and honor Him and tell him that He is now your Lord.
See, getting saved, in the final analysis is about accepting a gift and allowing it to posess you. You accept that Jesus loves you and died for you, and you allow this to affect you enough to the point that you admit that He now will be your Lord. And ask Him to forgive you for your sins, since He was punished for them already. He will if you ask
Getting saved is about recieving that Jesus is your:
Savior
and
Lord.
Savior - because He died to save you from your sins, so God would no longer have to punish you for what you've done. The good news is that Jesus rose from the dead and is still alive, so you can so that you would no longer be the same person because Jesus's spirit comes to live inside you and help you not keep sinning as well.
Lord - Because you love Him for what He's done for you and since He's still alive, you want to honor Him and obey Him to the best of your ability for the rest of your existance.
Let me know how it goes. We all are excited and waiting for you to reach out to Him. This is our first connection with God - meeting Jesus through His gift that He gave us at the cross. After that, you keep learning more about what that means, and how to live with a relationship with the one who loved you so intimately as to take your place in God's punishment. Remember, He is alive right now and wants to have a relationship with you! Open the door by receiving His gift, admitting you are sinner, that He died for you and you greatfully receive this gift you don't deserve. Then, give him yourself and call Him your Lord.
The Bible says that no one can honestly from their heart call Jesus their Lord (meaning master, one who they follow and obey) unless the Holy Spirit gives them that ability. If you reach out and truly call Jesus your Lord, that is the beginning of a long relationship with God through His Holy Spirit that you will begin to walk in!
From there, learn how to feed your spirit's connection to the Holy Spirit and read the post I wrote before this one!
heather